I have a bit of a confession to make about El Goonish Shive: it does not enrage me. It's bad, yes, but it's kinda like a baby that's just shit itself. Explosively. You can't really get mad at the baby, just at the situation.
Maybe it's the googly-eyed characters. Maybe it's the fact than Dan Shive actually comes across as a genuinely nice guy, and not just one of these "nice guys" who use their faux niceness to excuse being ignorant fuckwits. It's like if your younger brother comes up to you and shows you some little comic he's been working on, and you just can't bring yourself to saying "Danny, this is some serious balls."
That said, let's get on with tearing this comic to pieces.
El Goonish Shive is a stupid name for a stupid webcomic. It says nothing about the contents whatsoever, and probably never will. When's the last time that happened? Sluggy Freelance, that's when, and we all know what a fucking turd that is.
It begins by breaking the cardinal rule of webcomics: DO NOT WELCOME PEOPLE TO YOUR WEBCOMIC. This is a rule, and it is to be enforced on pain of death. If the first thing people read are your principle characters breaking the fourth wall, you instantly fail at your webcomic. Worse so when they do it for a week. Do I even need to list why? It's tacky, it's pointless, it's going to turn off potential readers... actually that's kind of a good thing. Because if you can only describe El Goonish Shive in one word, that word is "fetish".
"In case you can't tell, Tedd's a guy." Those words in the last panel of the first strip will haunt you. Because, more often than not, Tedd isn't a guy. He's a girl. Or a catgirl. Or a squirrelgirl. Or anything else. That goes for the rest of the cast, too. They change their genders, amongst other things, at an alarming rate. It's like a game of three-card Monte, or find the lady, whatever you want to call it. You try and pick the card that says "their natural gender" and instead you get "the opposite gender with superpowers". It's... it's something, all right. I don't really have the words for it.
Another big negative about the comic is the technobabble. It's not on a level with JDR's crazy "I AM QUEEN BITCH OF THE MULTIVERSE" shit, where he's invented a billion and one words and terms to describe the dreary shit he churns out. No, this is technobabble-lite - explains the effects but not the mechanics, although it's bullshit all the way. It's no less wordy and boring, either. Tedd, most usually, will go on for a whole comic about how his handy-dandy fetish gun can do this or that or boil an egg at thirty paces and go ding when there's stuff. Nanase, the typical half-Japanese weeaboo character, prattles on equally about her spells and super-Saiyan ki blasts. She's Tedd's cousin, apparently. Must run in the family.
You'd be forgiven for thinking this was lighthearted, what with all the zany goings on! It suffers from The Drama. You've got evil goo demon monsters, evil overlord alternate versions, whatever the Hell this shit is, and a birthday party that runs from May 2005 to September 2006.
And everyone is gender-swapped the whole time.
Now, I don't have any insight into the whole transgender fetish thing. Not my bag. But, really, don't make a comic about it. I mean, don't make a PG-13 comic about it. If you're churning out porno stuff then dickgirls and that shit are fine, especially if your audience is 4chan or whatever. But there's something deeply, darkly wrong with making this comic that can be and probably is read by children and having it as fap material for your grown-up fans.
I guess this is part of my bias. I don't appreciate the gender-swapping, catgirling, magic clone shit. That's why I think it's bad. Because I'm ignoring all that, focusing on the storyline instead. Grace, the female lead (or closest thing to it) had the shit beaten out of her! By some guy who looks like a demon and glows red-hot! This makes Tedd, her what-the-fuck boyfriend, pretty mad! It's short, sharp and provides the wonderful depth you just wouldn't be otherwise able to have without the Terracciano School of Character Development.
I kid, hack writers have been using this shit as an excuse for switching on their brains for decades. If not centuries, frankly. But if there is a dig to be made at JDR or Terracciano or anyone who I dislike, then that dig will be made! Besides, all of Terracciano's characters have the same kind of "tragic past" to them. Seriously, every single one ever. Go wikipedia it if you don't believe me.
Which is kind of why I'm not being too harsh on El Goonish Shive. There are genuine attempts, in there, to develop characters through better means. I just wish it didn't happen when one was covered in fur and the other was firing sex-beams out of her tits. Or whatever the shit is going on these days.
In summary, El Goonish Shive is like walking in on your parents having sex. It's love, and it's recognised as love between them both, but you just want to drink bleach until it's seared from your mind.
Maybe it's the googly-eyed characters. Maybe it's the fact than Dan Shive actually comes across as a genuinely nice guy, and not just one of these "nice guys" who use their faux niceness to excuse being ignorant fuckwits. It's like if your younger brother comes up to you and shows you some little comic he's been working on, and you just can't bring yourself to saying "Danny, this is some serious balls."
That said, let's get on with tearing this comic to pieces.
El Goonish Shive is a stupid name for a stupid webcomic. It says nothing about the contents whatsoever, and probably never will. When's the last time that happened? Sluggy Freelance, that's when, and we all know what a fucking turd that is.
It begins by breaking the cardinal rule of webcomics: DO NOT WELCOME PEOPLE TO YOUR WEBCOMIC. This is a rule, and it is to be enforced on pain of death. If the first thing people read are your principle characters breaking the fourth wall, you instantly fail at your webcomic. Worse so when they do it for a week. Do I even need to list why? It's tacky, it's pointless, it's going to turn off potential readers... actually that's kind of a good thing. Because if you can only describe El Goonish Shive in one word, that word is "fetish".
"In case you can't tell, Tedd's a guy." Those words in the last panel of the first strip will haunt you. Because, more often than not, Tedd isn't a guy. He's a girl. Or a catgirl. Or a squirrelgirl. Or anything else. That goes for the rest of the cast, too. They change their genders, amongst other things, at an alarming rate. It's like a game of three-card Monte, or find the lady, whatever you want to call it. You try and pick the card that says "their natural gender" and instead you get "the opposite gender with superpowers". It's... it's something, all right. I don't really have the words for it.
Another big negative about the comic is the technobabble. It's not on a level with JDR's crazy "I AM QUEEN BITCH OF THE MULTIVERSE" shit, where he's invented a billion and one words and terms to describe the dreary shit he churns out. No, this is technobabble-lite - explains the effects but not the mechanics, although it's bullshit all the way. It's no less wordy and boring, either. Tedd, most usually, will go on for a whole comic about how his handy-dandy fetish gun can do this or that or boil an egg at thirty paces and go ding when there's stuff. Nanase, the typical half-Japanese weeaboo character, prattles on equally about her spells and super-Saiyan ki blasts. She's Tedd's cousin, apparently. Must run in the family.
You'd be forgiven for thinking this was lighthearted, what with all the zany goings on! It suffers from The Drama. You've got evil goo demon monsters, evil overlord alternate versions, whatever the Hell this shit is, and a birthday party that runs from May 2005 to September 2006.
And everyone is gender-swapped the whole time.
Now, I don't have any insight into the whole transgender fetish thing. Not my bag. But, really, don't make a comic about it. I mean, don't make a PG-13 comic about it. If you're churning out porno stuff then dickgirls and that shit are fine, especially if your audience is 4chan or whatever. But there's something deeply, darkly wrong with making this comic that can be and probably is read by children and having it as fap material for your grown-up fans.
I guess this is part of my bias. I don't appreciate the gender-swapping, catgirling, magic clone shit. That's why I think it's bad. Because I'm ignoring all that, focusing on the storyline instead. Grace, the female lead (or closest thing to it) had the shit beaten out of her! By some guy who looks like a demon and glows red-hot! This makes Tedd, her what-the-fuck boyfriend, pretty mad! It's short, sharp and provides the wonderful depth you just wouldn't be otherwise able to have without the Terracciano School of Character Development.
I kid, hack writers have been using this shit as an excuse for switching on their brains for decades. If not centuries, frankly. But if there is a dig to be made at JDR or Terracciano or anyone who I dislike, then that dig will be made! Besides, all of Terracciano's characters have the same kind of "tragic past" to them. Seriously, every single one ever. Go wikipedia it if you don't believe me.
Which is kind of why I'm not being too harsh on El Goonish Shive. There are genuine attempts, in there, to develop characters through better means. I just wish it didn't happen when one was covered in fur and the other was firing sex-beams out of her tits. Or whatever the shit is going on these days.
In summary, El Goonish Shive is like walking in on your parents having sex. It's love, and it's recognised as love between them both, but you just want to drink bleach until it's seared from your mind.
61 comments:
- One thing you really have to admire about Dan is that you can't accuse him of not trying to improve, because - especially in the past few months - you can tell he makes an active effort to. Whether or not he actually does, at least he tries, and that counts for something. Anyway I don't really think El Goonish Shive was ever intended to be serious or feasible. If you can set realism aside for a bit it's not a bad comic, really. Of course, as a webcomic author you can't use that as an excuse, but as I said before at least he tries to improve on whatever he needs improving on.
- *Adds to list of boring and cliché satire reviews*
- Cliché-logger, I don't thing 'satire' means what you think it means.
- It's funny. Why is it that everyone just focuses on the fact that Mr. Solomon curses all the time? It doesn't matter how many times he says the fuck word. It won't change the fact that Dan Shive's concept of pacing is so terrible that he stretched a party which couldn't have lasted more than an evening into a storyline which lasted sixteen months while still maintaining a three-times-a-week schedule. How is that even possible? That's the sort of pacing you see in geology, not literature! I shudder to think of how Dan Shive would lay out a week's worth of story-time: we might conceivably enter another paleontological epoch by the time it's done.
- This is the only comic you've reviewed so far that I've ever actually read, and I was pleased by your inability to deliver a proper lashing. I used to like El Goonish Shive. Then I got bored of it. But I think that if Dan Shive had somehow managed to avoid the drama, I might have been able to enjoy the gender-swapping, energy-blasting, squirrel-morphing craziness. But, alas. Another one for the pile.
- I was going to post a worse example of pacing than the birthday party. But I decided to double check for accurate times and realized that I would have to re-read that shitty webcomic. So fuck that shit, I'll just insult cliché-logger's mother's heritage instead. Much easier.
- I think he's been doing the comic for like 5 years and the storyline has covered maybe 2 weeks of time? yeah and his excuse for constantly recapping the wacky science/magic information and sloth-fu storyline is that he's trying to make it more accessible to new readers, laffo
- This post has been removed by the author.
- rofl, I loved this! You truly have a talent for roasting comics, and your hyperbolic reference to "shooting sex beams from her tits" had me rolling. Of course, I disagree with your assessment of EOI--I happen to like it. But, I'm not going to make any excuses for it; this is definitely a niche product. I think you have to have a cartoon fetish to truly appreciate this comic. Yes, I do. Yes, I know this is weird. No, I don't give a shit. I like being me! ^_^
- Okay, I said this on BOTH of the Dominic Deegan threads but this needs to be nipped in the bud. ATTENTION EL GOONISH SHIVE FANS: DO NOT, by any means, comment on this review. It's what he wants, and it is a waste of time. If you want to defend EGs, you're better off just going ahead and sending Dan Shive a few dollars, or reading through the archives again, or hell, just staring at a blank wall for five minutes. This man is not going to magically change his views, trollish though they may be. Ever. So don't bother, ignore this sad little man's attempt at being offensive, and move on with your life.
- ahaha you think anyone cares
- Other anonymous guy, this is probably the least offensive post here - it largely amounts to "I'm really not into this at all."
- "oh god someone thinks 'el goonish shive' is a stupid name, TURN YOUR EYES TRUE BELIEVERS" bitch please
- JDR tried to get me to 'fess up my real name by saying I'd be killed if I did. You guys think that going "*yawn*" and "meh" and talking about how little you read this blog (which doesn't stop you from commenting fifty times on each entry) is supposed to make me go "Oh, some dicks don't like it. TIME TO PACK UP AND HEAD ON HOME." Notice the connection? Probably not, so I'll explain it for you. It's the glow of puffed-up self-importance that surrounds your comments that really makes me happy. So keep on with thinking that failed attempts at condescension are going to get me to think of your laughable comments as anything more but the delicious icing on a delicious cake.
- Hell, I'd think that your disapproval just makes me want to do this more.
- William G, I can't seem to find your e-mail to send you stuff, where is it? I'd very much like to contact you.
- Fun article. But "amongst"? Do you mean "among"? Do you say "whilst” when you mean “while”?
- "Amongst other things" is perfectly valid English. Just be glad I'm not Robert A. Howard of Tangents (by Robert A. Howard) because otherwise I'd say I "zinged" you by using complicated words.
- I'm kind of lost on how Dr. Solomon's reviews are "trolling". I always thought that "trolling" was going into someone else's house (message board, IRC channel, whatever) and trying to provoke a negative response. Dr. Solomon is putting all his cuss words up on his own website-thing, though. So technically all of his detractors are the ones trolling. I think. Maybe I'm just not up to date on my internet slang? Oh noes. Anyway, I can't wait until we get some reviews up for comics I actually read and/or enjoy (or have even heard of). I'm sure it'll be great fun.
- you should do the NOOB or Bellen!
- It seems to me that every single character is some sort of extension of Dan Shive. They're all understanding, nice, wonderful people who can get together and talk about whatever's going on in their lives and everyone else will treat it with the utmost understanding. They swap genders and tell each other they're gay and give out hugs and kisses and skritches and squees. I can only read about three pages of EGS before I have to turn it off and have to find Rambo or footage of people getting blown to smithereens or turn on NASCAR just to erase that shit from my mind. I don't have a thing against Dan Shive, but holy fuck there's something just completely fucking wrong about his comic.
- I'm just gonna say one thing about this blog now and leave--every single complaint in it was already a dead horse a year ago.
- oh i am seriously choked up here, please do not go mr. anonymous
- All hail KING Solomon!
- do sluggy freelance next COME ON MAN DO IT
- I'm just gonna say one thing about this blog now and leave--every single complaint in it was already a dead horse a year ago. Every single one? SAF wasn't even around a year ago. If these comics were getting these complaints a year ago, that means they haven't improved in a year. That is not a good thing.
- Anonymous said... Cliché-logger, I don't thing 'satire' means what you think it means. satire |ˈsaˌtīr| noun the use of humor, irony, exaggeration, or ridicule to expose and criticize people's stupidity or vices, particularly in the context of contemporary politics and other topical issues.
- These guyes seem to have the right idea about CAD. The "fan" comics made me laugh a bit. http://helixc.net/index.php/topic,3386.msg76534.html#msg76534 The more people who realise CAD is the web's version Garfield but with even less jokes, the better. Bloody CADdites.
- I knew a review of EGS would be coming, and I was looking forward to it most out of all the webcomics out there. But after reading this, it's a bit of a letdown. The comic is a far larger pile of shit than you make it out to be.
- I'm still not sure how to approach your blog, but that Doctor Who reference there certainly gave me a better opinion of you personally (even if it seems that you don't like Who all that much; at least your pop cultural range tells me you're not just some troll.)
- THERE ARE NO WEBCOMICS IN HELL!!!! John 3:16
- There are webcomics in Hell, but only User Friendly and Kit and Kay Boodle.
- Tagmosis: If Shive was really maintaining a three-a-week schedule, the party story would've been finished six months ago. Dude misses at *least* one update per week, and sometimes goes a week or two with nothing but fillers. Hell, he hasn't even been averaging *two* per week since February. Which means that yeah, I read it. *shrug* Doesn't mean I'm always thrilled.
- An exquisitely crafted way of saying "It's not for me." I would normally take points off for lacking anything in the constructive criticism department, but that's not what you do here. You probably could have gone deeper, but the generalizations of the biggest issues actually works out better for this topic. I'm a fan of the comic, but personally I enjoy sanity checks. Sometimes it's too easy to get caught up in thinking something is awesome, and you loose sight of how other people see things. I'll admit all the things you pointed out about the comic, and simply add that I like it anyway. To each his own, and keep up the dirty work.
- Sorry, was unfair in the previous post. Any criticism can be constructive criticism so long it is valid, clearly stated, and properly received. Your points are valid and clearly stated, they're just not put nicely. Again though, that's not what you're here for. Despite the mockery, I think you do provide a service though. It's good sometimes to have a blunt, irreverent evaluation of work you hold dear, it helps keep you grounded. Also, it's not healthy to take yourself too seriously.
- I want a 16-month birthday party. And sex-beams shooting from my friends' tits wouldn't be too bad.
- I used to like EGS. It was a strange relationship, between the comic and I. I've been getting older, and it kind of made me feel young again. Anyway, I always like... rage-quit it, and then come back to it. I rage because the author basically has no concept of a schedule, and never will. Even now he's like 3 weeks behind schedule or some shit. It's fucking absurd, especially when thinking that the only thing I'm going to get is probably some filler or some really horrible attempt to progress the story. EGS is only good in big chunks, and the chunks come reaaaallllllllll slow. Fail.
- The thing is, I rather am into the transgender catgirl fetish... Which makes 90% of the cryticism null. It was still an amusing read.
- Don't admit shit like that, dude.
- I just laughed out loud for like 10 minutes at that scolding.
- What the FUCK?!? Why does this shit posted my fucking name there? Now I can't share this site with friends for the fear of them reading my previous post...
- Hahahaha, you probably had a "blogger account," (No idea what that is, even though I seemed to have one as well) so it just automatically gave that as your name. 'Scool, though, just make your way to 4chan's /d/ and don't worry about it. As far as The Goodan Shive goes, I just don't know what's up with that guy, and completely agree with the "little brother" analogy. It is for precisely that deep-seated and almost palpable benevolence that I find myself unable to hate what is certainly an inexcusable and slightly creepy mess. To my mind, it is worth the few seconds it takes to see that he hasn't updated to find out, one day, what new and completely unfathomable thing Dan Shive has presented us with this time, and which we will, with a certainty, never see anywhere else (except, of course, for Japan-ese porn...). And let it be known that there is one other creative medium in which a one-day party can last sixteen months: King Syndicate Comic Strips. EGS has something in common with Mary Worth. Think about that.
- What if your comic doesn't have a fourth wall? I suppose it automatically makes it shit and nullifies any enjoyment anyone gets out of it. Okay never mind.
- Dan might be a nice guy, sure, but that doesn't change the fact that in five years of story-telling the only thing that has improved the smallest bit is his art, and that's probably only because he needed it so that he could draw all the pictures of his fetishes more clearly. Seriously, I don't know exactly how much he cares about characterization and coherent story-telling, but it is so painfully obvious that anything halfway good that ever comes out of his comic is just a side effect of his little wish fulfillment fantasies about turning girls into men and men into girls and girls into animals and shrinking people and growing people and every other taboo thing he might think about.
- I've had EGS recommended to me a couple of times, but I've never read it, simply because I've never been able to get past that first strip. Thanks for sparing me the pain.
- fuck I actually used to read this shitty comic. When I was like 15, and I didn't know any better. I was going through the stupid typical sexuality confusion and this comic spoke to me, in a patently retarded sort of way. Eventually I got over it, and I noticed that something was severely off about this comic I was reading, I just couldn't put my finger on it. I just KNEW there was something rotten in there, something horrifying. It was like sitting in a German city, looking up at the ceiling, listening to the planes, wondering when the carpet bombing would start. Sure enough, then it hit me: This shit is just an excuse for this weird little fucker to draw transgender squirrels and other crazy shit like that. I quit the forums on the spot and went to 4chan. By the time I got over that shit and went to another forum, I noticed that internet forums are just like censored, watered down versions of 4chan that only use old-ass memes, and I've been the internet equivalent of a shut-in ever since.
- fuck I actually used to read this shitty comic. When I was like 15, and I didn't know any better. I was going through the stupid typical sexuality confusion and this comic spoke to me, in a patently retarded sort of way. Eventually I got over it, and I noticed that something was severely off about this comic I was reading, I just couldn't put my finger on it. I just KNEW there was something rotten in there, something horrifying. It was like sitting in a German city, looking up at the ceiling, listening to the planes, wondering when the carpet bombing would start. Sure enough, then it hit me: This shit is just an excuse for this weird little fucker to draw transgender squirrels and other crazy shit like that. I quit the forums on the spot and went to 4chan. By the time I got over that shit and went to another forum, I noticed that internet forums are just like censored, watered down versions of 4chan that only use old-ass memes, and I've been the internet equivalent of a shut-in ever since.
- wow... just wow I can't believe you have the audacity to call Mookie a pompous ass and then start citing some rules about web comics you made up. Since when is it not ok to break the fourth wall? Since you said so? Who made you the keeper of the web comic rules and regulations? Especially for someone else's comic. Dan works a lot harder on his comic than you do on your pathetic blog. Maybe you should make your own web comic and then you can see just how hard it is. I'm guessing that you have no imagination and could never make one. So, to compensate for that and your small penis you criticize other people's hard work. I'll bet you couldn't write a comic that is on the level with your "high and mighty" standards. Your Blog is terrible and you should feel bad...and then die in a fire...because I'm guessing that more people will miss Dominic Deegan when it ends than your burned corpse. Oh by the way just as a suggestion if you are going to critique another person's work you might want to lay off of the swearing and poop jokes. At least try to show a little professionalism. You know the thing that you keep demanding from the comics you review.
- The Rules of Web Comics 1. Make as much drama as possible 2. More Furries 3. ??? 4. Profit
- Not kidding about that profit thing either...Why are they always selling their comics in a book if you can read them online free?
- wow... just wow I can't believe you have the audacity to call Mookie a pompous ass and then start citing some rules about web comics you made up. Haha. Oh, wait, you're serious? Hahahahahahaha.
- because I'm guessing that more people will miss Dominic Deegan when it ends than your burned corpse. Doubtful since Dominic Deegan will never fucking end so long as Terracciano can keep squeezing money out of you gullible chucklefucks.
- Bingo, by the way.
- I'm an El Goonish Shive fan, of sorts. I don't appreciate every aspect of the comic, and have drifted away from it somewhat over the last year, but still like it. Given that, I think this review is hilarious, and that's because I'm laughing with it, not at it. Some fair points are made, and I may not agree with them but they're made in a funny way. I can't see why people have an issue with it if they simply don't agree.
- Ha Ha- I'll admit I check out the webcomic from time to time. Yeah, Dan seems like a nice guy who has never had a close friend and will never have a girlfriend, ever in his life. You didn't mention just how awkward and unrealistic the dialogue can get, he's obviously missing the practice that comes from talking to people. There's also a weird contrast to the webcomic basically centering around weird sexual fetishes, and the complete prudish lack of sex - I don't mean anything graphic, I mean simple sex jokes, or implications that people are getting it on, or whatever. I don't want the squirrel porn, but it's obvious to all that the guy has a dossier filed away somewhere, with notebook after notebook of female-Ted porn. Also skipped over that there's about a two in three chance that his latest update will be an apology for not having a comic ready, but he still claims a determined schedule. He had a hilariously pathetic (if barely updated) blog up at: http://dshive.blogspot.com/ where he claims to be half-Vulcan and half-Betazoid (Betazoids were like the psychic Deanna Troi so maybe he's psychic, I don't get the reference) In an alternative universe that's what people on the internet say instead of "I have Asperger's." He's probably a really interesting person to know, actually.
- Yeah, the guy is nice, having talked to him. But it's that kind of depressing, naive nice that you can tell stems from having an over-protected, friendless childhood. And he doesn't know how to write dialogue. Everything his characters say just seems.. wrong. Like some sort of alien invaders pretending to be human but they just can't get it right. Like in Star Wars. And on the guy who mentioned why they sell books of this stuff, it's so the mid-teenage fans can get away from the family computer in the living room and read the comic upstairs, in their rooms, alone. In the night.
- Ok, so I have now read all of EGS, and it was kind of like looking at a car wreck: it's terrible and horrifying, and you're sad for the people involved, but you can't look away. I'm sure Dan has the potential to learn good webcomic design and storytelling, he just has to stop this TG comic stuff. Also, I think the sex beam was out of hear hands, not her boobs, though that would be more fitting.
- John Solomon is Charlie Brooker.
- I like EGS. My big complaint would be the incredibly unreliable updates. If the fetish stuff doesn't bother you (I'm asexual, and think normal, heterosexual sex and Shive's fetish stuff are equally creepy, so I'm used to tuning it out), it's quite cute. The conclusion to Painted Black sucked, though.
- Quit fucking commenting on things that are over a year old.
- I'll comment on what I like, you fucking little tyrant, especially when coming late to a great blog like this. Cliche-logger is an assclown who STILL doesn't understand what constitutes satire, despite getting out 'My First Dictionary'. Shitty webcomics deserve a vicious kicking. Don't cry and whinge - improve.
